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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: Jan 20, 2010 1:47pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

I think you're right and I used the wrong word. Do you think 'conceit' would fit better?

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Jan 20, 2010 2:00pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

I think the myth is that deadheads are mostly guys. One hears, for instance, about "deadheads and hippie chicks" as if they were, historically, two separate categories. Like the chicks were a sort of women's auxiliary rather than actual appreciators of the music.

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Poster: TOOTMO Date: Jan 20, 2010 2:55pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

" Like the chicks were a sort of women's auxiliary rather than actual appreciators of the music."




TOOTMO

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Poster: William Tell Date: Jan 20, 2010 10:08pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

Whoa--that really got me thinking, and this is almost too much to admit, as I don't know what to make of it...it may be a really sad reflection on me, and my friends, but at first I thought what you outlined (the myth) was of course just that...then I thought, "yeah there is...and then there is also...hmmmm" and I realized I couldn't name ANY gals from our "group" that were really into the DEAD.

So, it is a very biased sample because in HS I became friends with a DEAD cover band that happened to be all guys, and all the other guys were friends from B-ball, so it started as a big group of guys going to the DEAD about the time we started dating seriously...then, lots of gals came along to concerts, some were even eventually married to these "original guys", but now that I think of it, of the 20 or so women, I don't think one owns a DEAD record/tape/CD for example...

Except for my little sister...but, we may or may not be able to count her in the sample, bias wise?

Would this be true for any number of bands? Dunno.

Does this mean in addition to the "where's God in the DEAD?" that we need to ask "were the DEAD sexist pigs"? (har, har...hmmm...think we have covered this one actually--right, Rob?).

So, Jess & Ring-a-lo: what was your experience? In the 80s were there more guys than gals? You two certainly qualify, as does Miss D and the few others, as serious, but maybe the ratio was always biased toward males...

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Jan 21, 2010 8:08am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

Sure they were sexist pigs. But they were hardly the only ones. I don't hold it against them ... I've just been surprised to find sexist pigs among deadheads *now* ...

It was just the era (defining "era" as the past several millennia, I suppose). The women around the grateful dead seem to have played fairly stereotypical roles in supporting the men, raising the children, etc. I'm sure as individuals the surviving members have changed with the times.

Among the friends I saw them with in the early eighties, I only recall one other woman who as seriously "into" them. I wasn't seriously into them then, either, I was along for the ride and acting fairly stereotypical myself. It was definitely the men who organized it all (if you want to call it organization; scored the dope, in other words), and the women tended to be attached romantically to the various men.

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Poster: William Tell Date: Jan 21, 2010 8:25am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

That fits my experience as well...oh, and I should mention--we have covered it a few times before, so I was joking about Rob going and finding the threads. As opposed to the variety of opinions on Jerry and religion, the prior threads were largely concordant with your take (ie, everyone agreed they were sexist, Pig, appropriately enough, the leader of the pack).

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Poster: ringolevio Date: Jan 21, 2010 8:43am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

I was thinking someone should write Mountain Girl's biography (if it hasn't been done) ... she seems a pretty talented and powerful person herself, and was definitely assigned a supporting role that she probably wouldn't put up with today if she were young and in that situation.

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Poster: jessandra Date: Jan 20, 2010 11:29pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

I'm sure there were more guys than gals but I never counted ... ;-) !

Well actually - the core of my deadhead 'clique' from the mid 80s were mainly female! Between myself and my 2 best girlfriends from that time we probably collected more AUD cassettes than most of the average male heads - and we are all still collecting and listening!

I think there may be a slight difference in that we developed into deadheads and discovered a passion for the music all by ourselves - and had never just 'accompanied' a boyfriend etc. We did occasionally have a boyfriend who 'accompanied' us but I'll bet they didn't catch the bug as we had it and likely don't have any tapes/cds today either;-

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Poster: William Tell Date: Jan 21, 2010 5:10am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

Perhaps there is something to the self development aspect; my little sister would be an exception as would my kids and some of the folks I turned on I suppose...hmm--now that I think along those lines, of the orig folks, there were three that "self developed" and the rest came after (12-20).

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Jan 20, 2010 1:55pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

starting sound more like a dorky wordsmith club around here.

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: Jan 20, 2010 2:17pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

Words of nuance, words of skill
And words of romance are a thrill
Words are stupid, words are fun
Words can put you on the run

What are words worth?
What are words worth? - words

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Jan 20, 2010 2:29pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

Facts are simple and facts are straight
Facts are lazy and facts are late
Facts all come with points of view
Facts don't do what I want them to
Facts just twist the truth around
Facts are living turned inside out
Facts are getting the best of them
Facts are nothing on the face of things

btw I'm still waiting....

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: Jan 20, 2010 2:33pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

"btw I'm still waiting...."

For me to respond to your most generous email? I did - let me know if I need to resend.

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Jan 20, 2010 3:11pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

no i got it and will reply when i get a chance to think about it.

i was just goofing around with the song.

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: Jan 20, 2010 3:23pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

ahhhhh... sometimes I don't get things.

Anyway, while you're here - I 'm listening to 14-11-73 at the San Diego Sports Arena right now and I'm really thinking that November 73 could be a great money no object fantasy boxset - this is easily as good as the Winterland shows. I'm hearing great interplay between Bob and Keith - sometimes its good to tune out Jerry and Phil and listen to what else is going on. But I'm rambling on (Rose) and I should go to bed I know...

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Jan 20, 2010 3:35pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

Yes. When those top 10 lists were floating about the other day i figured half the shows i would pick from '73 might be in November, including the one you mention. Believe it or not I think SDH once said something fairly insightful about this show. I think he commented about the fact that it doesn't have a big PITB or a Dark Star but it still delivers the goods. Besides who doesn't love a Triple Decker TOO sandwich? Might give you heartburn before bed though.

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: Jan 20, 2010 3:52pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

And would you agree that the TOO is very much a team effort? I find myself listening to the different instrumental voices blending in much the same way as I'd approach listening to a Beethoven string quartet - in fact I often find myself thinking of Jerry, Phil, Bob and Keith in that way, everything blends, everything contributes to the whole. If you set out to write it down beforehand, you couldn't write it better than it is. This 14-11-73 TOO suite is magisterial. I'd go so far as to say that I have a feeling of privilege being able to listen to it. Well, ok enough for tonight I guess.

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Jan 20, 2010 6:54pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: You Know You Are A DeadHead When...

I think I understand what you mean although I don't think you can discount Billy's voice in this gem. I think he blends in with the rest of them. If you want you can try to tease out each part but at times its too damn hard and frankly not as much fun as letting the music just wash over you in total as if you are sitting at the water's edge, the surf is up and tide is coming in.

I know you don't discount Billy's contributions, you made that quite clear the other day.